Interview with David L. Heiserman

Two of David L. Heiserman’s Books

I originally wrote this interview for the blog
Ask any roboticist of a certain age, whether a professional or hobbyist, how they first got interested in robots. Odds are good they’ll mention a 1976 TAB book, written by David L. Heiserman, called Build Your Own Working Robot. The book described the construction of Buster, a small, wheeled robot. This was before the era of ubiquitous microprocessors. Buster’s brain was a mass of TTL logic chips that implemented surprisingly complex behaviours. In some ways, Buster was not unlike Grey Walter’s vacuum tube-based turtle robots from the late 1940s and was likely the first significant step forward in behavior-based robots since Walter’s turtles. Did you ever wonder what Dave did after writing those books or what he’s up to today? Read on to find out!

Two years after Build Your Own Working Robot was published, Dave Heiserman returned with another robot book that brought behaviour-based robots into the computer age. The new book, called How to Build Your Own Self-Programming Robot, described the construction of Rodney. Starting with no knowledge, Rodney explored and learned about his world through trial-and-error, using what he learned to anticipate future explorations.

All of this behaviour-based robotics stuff was considered a bit kooky by mainstream researchers in the 1970s, who favored top-down strong AI. Why bother building little insect-level robots that puttered around on the floor? Machines needed to understand deep philosophical questions first. They needed to represent the entire world symbolically and reason about it like human brains. Only then would we be ready to put them on wheels or legs. So even though hobbyists almost immediately set to work building Buster clones, Heiserman was largely ignored elsewhere. But mainstream AI was already running into dead ends, entering what’s now known as the AI Winter. And those Buster-building hobbyists were entering Universities and beginning to set the stage for a change in the direction of AI research. Before long, Rodney Brooks arrived on scene and coined the name ‘subsumption architecture’ to describe his own bottom-up, behaviour-based robots. Robotics and AI research were revitalized.

While you aren’t likely to see a mention of Heiserman in any official history of AI or robotics, it hard to imagine that his books didn’t play a part in those changes. Even today I find that most hobby roboticists still remember him. Many still have the two books shown above or one of his many other books. I was reminded of this recently when, during a visit the Dallas Personal Robotics Group, I ran across several copies of Build Your Own Working Robot in the group’s library. I picked one up, opened it, and realized it was the very copy that I had bought in 1976 and later donated to the DPRG. It got me thinking about all of this and I wondered whether Dave might still be around. I set out to find him and, along the way, I collected questions from other robot builders; questions they’d always wanted to ask the author whose books inspired their interest in robotics. I did find Dave and he graciously agreed to an interview. Below you’ll find his answers to your questions.

Robots.Net (RN): How did you become interested in robots? Was the Buster robot your first attempt at building a robot or had you built previous ones? And, if so, what were they like?

David L. Heiserman (DLH): I grew up fascinated by robot stories, especially those from sci-fi movies of the 50s–“The Day the Earth Stood Still” and “Forbidden Planet,” for example. I built a radio-controlled “robot” in the early 70s. The thing I remember most about that machine was the convulsions it always suffered during a thunder storm. Also, I really enjoyed showing people how they can do things that were commonly thought to be only for big research labs and budgets. So I also did a book on amateur radio astronomy and home-made video games.

RN: How did your first robot book deal with TAB come about? There weren’t a lot of non-fiction robot books or hobby robot clubs at that time. What got you interested in writing a book about robotics and how’d TAB get involved?

DLH: Before I hooked up with TAB Books, I was already building a reputation for writing technical and computer care-and-feeding PC books for Prentice-Hall. I don’t recall the details, but I probably approached TAB with the idea for robot books (naturally P-H had no interest in such manuscripts). There was one other do-it-yourself robot book circulating at the time my first ones appeared.


RN: How to Build Your Own Working Robot credits the students of Ohio Institute of Technology in Columbus for helping with Buster. Can you tell us a little about how the project was done and how the students were involved in helping? Did the school have a robotics or mechatronics program at that time?

DLH: The school simply agreed to provide the hardware and allow a couple of my BE students to get special lab credit for building Buster according to my specs. The school got its due credit when the project “went viral” for a few weeks with radio interviews, TV spots and a feature article in Rolling Stone. This was a 2-year technical college, and the closest thing to industrial robotics were courses in Industrial Electronics.


RN: How did you pick the names Buster and Rodney? I’ve heard people ask if Rodney was named for Rodney Brooks but your Rodney preceded Brooks’ work by some years didn’t it?

DLH: As you probably know, when you work on a machine for a while, it begins taking on a personality. Those names simply popped into my head while tinkering with them. Yes, I think Rodney Brooks was graduating from college about the time my first robot-intelligence books appeared. He has done far more than I would ever care to do with intelligent machines.


RN: Do any of the Buster or Rodney robots still exist? What became of them? Do you currently have a robot of any kind around the house?

DLH: Rodney is gone, but Buster has been resting peacefully in my basement for a few decades. There are no other robots. I’m not even close to being a contemporary robot enthusiast.


RN: What’s the story behind the cover photo on Build Your Own Working Robot? Was that merely a mock up someone made for the book cover or was that a real robot?

DLH: It is an embarrassing mock up created by the graphics department at TAB. I was unaware of it until the first copies appeared in my mail.


RN: Most people in the hobby robot community, even today, have heard of you and your robot books. But I’m not aware of you having any direct interactions with the modern hobby robot community. Once the books were completed did you continue to have an interest in robotics? Do robot hobbyists correspond with you very often? Do you speak at local hobby robot events?

DLH: I have no direct interaction with the hobby robot community today. I do get a bit discouraged at all the publicity for annual robot competitions around the world, using machines that are no more sophisticated than a Radio Shack toy. On the other hand, I’ve seen some marvellous little “cognitive” machines on YouTube. I have no particular interest in anything but the purely philosophical aspects of robotics today. I hear from a hobby robot person every 4-5 years.

No, I haven’t spoken publicly since that one-and-only international hobby robotics convention in Albuquerque, NM. That was in the mid-80s. I think. That was sort of the pinnacle of robot experience–sharing the platform with Isaac Asimov. (editors note: I believe this was the International Personal Robot Congress & Exposition of April 13-15, 1984. you can read a firsthand account on


RN: Are you aware of many readers who successfully built the robot designs in your books and perhaps improved on them?

DLH: Yes. I occasionally do online searches for people referencing my robot books. That’s how I keep up with the improvements people have made to my initial ideas.


RN: The designs presented in your books were arguably the most advanced in terms of behavior-based robots since Grey Walter’s turtles from the late 1940s, and until Rodney Brooks’ subsumption based robots of the late 1980s. Did you ever publish in any research journals or garner any interest from University roboticists about your designs?

DLH: I often feel like the Rodney Dangerfield (“Rodney?”} of robotics in that “I get no respect” — at least not from the academic world. The respect I do get comes from the people I always intended to encourage, enlighten, and entertain in the first place — you guys.


RN: Prior to Brooks, the AI community seemed more interested in complex top-down approaches that started with human-level intelligence tasks. You took an evolutionary approach that started with simple behaviours and worked toward more advanced ones. Were you aware you were bucking the trend at the time and did you ever discuss the two approaches with other roboticists or researchers? I’m curious if your approach was well-received at the time or considered too strange for mainstream researchers of 1970s?

DLH: I was fully aware that I was bucking the trend, and there were a few in the AI community of that time who really believed they were obligated to “straighten me out.” But I took comfort in knowing I was having a whole lot more fun with little machines actually functioning with 16k of RAM than they with their plans that required the then-impossible amount of memory for mapping every possible environment. Sometimes it is simply the last man standing that wins the game.


RN: Did you ever consider taking any of your robot designs commercial as kits or assembled robots?

DLH: I never did it on my own initiative, but Rodney appeared on the market as RB5-X. It was advertised as educational tool, and we had a couple of RB5s running around in the science center here in Columbus. The company was RB Robot, Inc., in Golden CO. When RB when bankrupt, someone else bought the rights and inventory. I don’t think the machine is around anywhere these days. I was just a token consultant for the company, anyway. (editors note: RB Robotics still exists but no longer manufacturers the RB5-X. However, the website promises a new robot will be revealed in 2012)


RN: Do you have any future plans regarding robots – more books, more research, anything like that?

DLH: No. As I mentioned earlier, I have some philosophical interest … but that’s all.


RN: What have you been up to since your last robot book? Are you currently working on any interesting projects (robot-related or not) that you’d like to tell us about?

DLH: My current brainchild will be 15 years old in August, 2012. Check it out at Free education. and career-building for the digital age. Yes, I’m catching a lot of the same flack I got years ago with the evolutionary machine intelligence thing. But I’m hanging onto this project, and the times are catching up with me. It’s a rush.

Robots, Cyborgs, and Androids of A-Kon 22

Borg cosplay at A-Kon 22

I attended A-Kon 22 recently and tried to spot all the robots, androids, and cyborgs among the 18,000+ cosplayers and anime fans wandering the downtown Dallas Sheraton. You can see all my A-Kon 22 photos on Flickr or read on an overview of the robots I spotted.

Two R2 robot at A-Kon

The most obvious were the two full-sized R2D2s built by Dallas Personal Robotics Group members Jeff Koenig and Glenn Pipe. These two robots attracted massive crowds where ever they went and spent hours posing for photos with cosplayers. (Jeff’s R2 has its own Facebook page with at least 300 more photos from A-Kon 22)

R2D2 wasn’t the only famous fictional robot there, of course. Crow T. Robot and Tom Servo from Mystery Science Theater 3000 were also around, as was some distant relative of Tom Servo who was part Transformer and part evil, tentacled alien (or something).

Brad Foster at A-Kon

Robots of all types were all well-represented in the art department. Well known artist Brad Foster was there. I first met Brad at an AggieCon back in the 1980s and he’s still going strong, drawing robots of all shapes and sizes. He’s published a book of some of his best robot art called, appropriately, Bots. You can find Brad’s Bot book and other art on his website.

There were also books like Sherard Jackson’s Draw Mecha that could teach you how to draw robots. And there were plenty of comic books and graphic novels about robots, cyborgs, exoskelton-clad super heros, and just about every other form of robotic hardware you can imagine. Oh, and robot T-shirt artwork too.

Three dimensional figurine type things have also become common at conventions lately. Most seems to be aimed at either gamers or collectors of tiny replicas of scantily-clad female Anime characters. However, robots are represented amongst the dolls and figurines too. Some of these tiny robot models are amazingly detailed little machines.

I’m sure I’m leaving out some of the robot goodness of A-Kon 22 as well as all the other crazy stuff such as the ballet group that was re-enacting famous dances from Cowboy Bebop and other Anime, the major steampunk contingent that showed up this year, and the blinking, glowing ravers who appear in the early morning hours. Go check out my gallery of A-Kon 22 photos. Or my older sets from A-Kon 20 and the A-Kon 20 rave.

2011 VEX Robotics World Championship

Kari Byron congratulates a winning team

I was invited out to Orlando, FL to photograph the 2011 VEX Robotics World Championship last week. It was bigger and busier than ever this year. There were lots of things going on besides just VEX matches this year including BEST, Boy Scout, and Coast Guard robot events. It’s also turning into a good networking event. I ran into old friends, met friends I’d previously known only online, and even made some new friends. If you want to go straight to the photos (600+), head over to my Flickr 2011 VEX Robotics World Championship gallery.

Every year, the VEX Robotics World Championship gets bigger. This year it topped 500 teams, and more than 10,000 total participants, from around the world. For 2011, the event moved to the Walt Disney World’s ESPN Wide World of Sports complex near Orlando, FL from its previous location in Dallas, TX. The smaller venue resulted in the VEX event being spread out across multiple buildings as well a large temporary structure. Vendors were scattered around in small tents outdoors and some events were held on the baseball field. The downside to this was a lot more walking and decreased probability of seeing the random cool things that teams spontaneously do like parading around, playing instruments and dancing. But the upside (at least for the younger crowd) was the proximity to all the Disney theme parks.

I only saw one alligator during my four days in Florida but every evening as I walked back to my hotel room, I saw dozens of green anoles scurrying out my way. They were apparently attracted to the warm sidewalks after sunset.

This year’s VEX challenge was called Round Up and involved the usual tasks of moving red or blue objects around on a square field. You can check out the Round Up challenge description if you’re curious about the details. As always, the teams of all age groups came up with ingenious robot designs to tackle the problem. There were a lot more university teams this year than last year in addition to the many High School and Middle School teams. There were also more all girl teams again this year. If VEX is any indication, expect to see more female engineers in the future.

In addition to their own matches, VEX hosted other events including the BEST championship and the US Coast Guard Academy’s AROW water robotics competition. The Boy Scouts of America also showed up with lots of scouts, robots, and scouting officials so we could watch the first scouts ever finish the requirements for the recently announced robotics merit badge. There were other distractions including a DJ, random Disney characters, live music, dancing, and occasional pyrotechnics.

The BEST teams continue to be the most enthusiastic robot builders I’ve seen. Anytime someone mentions the B-word, the response from all the BEST teams is deafening, even though I’m pretty sure all that noise is coming from a much smaller number of people than the VEX group. Somebody needs to figure out what BEST is doing in the cheer training department – it’s definitely working.

Artist Kari Byron of MythBusters and Head Rush hosted the event. Last year, MythBuster’s Grant Imahara hosted but I think Kari may have him beat on popularity with the kids. What better role model for aspiring female engineers than Kari? And teenage boys seem to really like her too for some reason. In addition to her duties as MC, Kari put in endless hours posing for millions of photos with robot builders (and robots) as well as signing autographs.

VEX Competitions have many awards, lots of complicated “alliances” between multiple teams, and several different divisions, so I won’t even attempt to tell you who won what. If you’re curious about that sort of thing check out the 2011 VEX Robotics World Championship Awards & Results list. You can read the official VEX news release or check out the more detailed press kit with photos and video.

And, of course, I shot photos while I was there. Lots and lots of photos. More photos than you could possible want to look at. You’ll find them over in my 2011 VEX World Championship photo gallery (Update: by popular demand, here’s a link to just the Kari Byron photos).

Evidence of Language Influencing Thought

The 19th century Sapir-Whorf hypothesis, that ideas inherent in human languages might influence or limit human thought, has spawned a wide range of claims, some little more than urban legend; like the claim that the Inuit have hundreds of words for snow (they don’t, Inuit has a half-dozen words for snow, that’s fewer than English, and there’s no evidence they think differently about snow than we do). In the 1960s researchers began to formulate tests of the hypothesis. What they learned is that language was more universal than relative, leading them to largely abandon the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis. In recent years, though, advances in cognitive science have made it possible to spot experimental differences that might have been missed before. So is there any real evidence now that language influences thought? A new Edge article by Lera Boroditsky says yes. Boroditsky researches cognitive science and symbolic systems – thought and language. She claims to have found solid evidence in Pormpuraaw, an Aboriginal community in Australia:

the Kuuk Thaayorre, like many other Aboriginal groups, use cardinal-direction terms — north, south, east, and west — to define space. This is done at all scales, which means you have to say things like “There’s an ant on your southeast leg” or “Move the cup to the north northwest a little bit.” … The result is a profound difference in navigational ability and spatial knowledge between speakers of languages that rely primarily on absolute reference frames (like Kuuk Thaayorre) and languages that rely on relative reference frames (like English).

She goes on to describe how the researchers tested whether these differences were actually caused by the language or some other aspect of the culture. While these sorts of cognitive differences may not be as significant as early proponents of the “language defines thought” concept imagined, Lera Boroditsky makes the case that they are both real and testable. This is certainly something to think about when designing machines that will think and use language.

If you’d like to learn more, I also found this interesting video of Lera talking about these aspects of language and thought at a Long Now conference.

2009 Texas Robot Build-Off


After the success of last year’s B9 Build Off Day, Jerry Chevailer held a new Build-Off in 2009. This year’s has been expanded to include all type of robots. The even was held at Jerry’s house in Rowlett, Texas. Builders of movie and TV robot replicas from all over the US gathered there for a few days of fun, food, and robot building. The two most heavily represented robots were Star Wars Astromechs like R2-D2 and the Lost in Space B9 robots. Member of several robot groups attended including the Dallas Personal Robotics Group, the B9 Builders Club, and the R2-D2 Builders Group.

I was able to stop by for a few hours and shoot some photos. Unfortunately, it rained that day so most of the robots were squeezed into the house and garage. It was sunny the next day and I heard that I missed Astromech street racing as well as some pretty amazing dancing by Jerry’s B9. For more photos of the event, check out my full Texas Build Off photo gallery on Flickr.

Two B9 robots hanging out in the garage
Robby, Gort, and some Star Wars droids
B9 builders did a live video chat with Dick Tufeld, voice of the Lost in Space robot

Day of the Androids at Hanson Robotics


I got to spend some time at Hanson Robotics a while back, talking to David Hanson and his staff and shooting photos for Robot Magazine (see the Jul/Aug issue for more). My hope is that the photos will give you an idea what a typical day working at Hanson Robotics is like. The day I was there, everyone was preparing androids and other robots for an upcoming TED conference. In the photo above Bill Hicks is integrating an eye assembly into the head of Hanson’s newest android, known as Bina. Several other projects were underway at the same time, including preparation of a Zeno prototype and fabrication of a new mini Einstein toy robot.

To see the full set of photos visit my Hanson Robotics Gallery on flickr. Also, don’t forget to pick up the Jul/Aug issue of Robot Magazine at your local newstand if you haven’t already got it!

David Hanson shows off the Frubber skin for Bina’s head
Bill Hicks working on Bina’s facial actuators
Loren Somen, the Director of Arts, works on a mold that will be used to make heads for small Albert Einstein robots (a prototype body is visible in the background).
David Hanson describing one of his first 3D printed android skulls
Kevin Carpenter, Director of Hardware Development, works on the Bina’s neck assembly
Prototypes for the Zeno android
Richard Margolin working on a Zeno prototype.
Several Android head prototypes

These are just a few of the photos so be sure to check out the full Hanson Robotics gallery over on Flickr for wider shots of the lab, more photos of Zino, Einstein, and Bina androids, and lots of other cool stuff from my day at Hanson Robotics!